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SeanFulop

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
As part of my 2005 QP wide array of missed details and poor assembly, I think that one of its wheels never received any factory clearcoat. Please see the attached pic of my passenger rear wheel. All the dark patches are pure rust. This is the only wheel on the car that is significantly corroded, the others have only minor pitting at worst, although the driver side rear wheel clearcoat is peeling off bit by bit.

I am going to try and have the rear wheels refinished. I wondered if anyone else has had problems with the factory finish on the wheels.
 

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That is a result of the detail shops. Detailers, including those at the dealerships, use "wheel acid" to clean the wheels. It immediately cleans the wheel inside and out with very little effort. You'll see it at any car wash (and at the dealer) in a 5-gallon bucket with a push-broom size brush and handle. It does an amazing job but after the 15th-20th wash, you'll start to see the fading. Then eventually, the paint will fade, peel and corrosion will start. Mercedes used this for years in the 80s and all the "flat" wheels on the SELs and SLs were stripped of paint by their 5th birthday. This is why I use a mild dish soap and all of the wheels on all of my cars, even after 100s of thousands of miles are like new. AND, I live right on the ocean, where corrosion is the #1 enemy.

Not to defend Maserati with any type of bias, but I'm curious, as a 2005 owner, what missed details you've noticed and what indicates poor assembly.

Keep in mind that your car was assembled using components (electronic and hardware) from various Ferrari cars of that era. For example, your firewall forward parts (windshield wiper assembly, etc.) is right off the 599, as is your entire steering column, cover, etc. Your mirrors are 612. Many buttons and electronic components are from 599, 612 and 430. Your brakes, suspension and power train are pure Ferrari bred and built. Your paint (assuming it is original) is straight Ferrari quality. From a sedan perspective, I equate it to Bentley/RR. Factory wet sanded with slight imperfections inside the door jams indicating hand finishing. All the body lines and gaps are perfect. The interior has incredible visibility and zero dash glare - a huge problem in many cars. Regardless, I can assure you that the factory in which your car was built wasn't composed of jack asses bumping into each other forgetting to tighten screws and paint wheels. Typical deficiencies in used QPs are generally a result of replaced parts and wear caused by various levels of neglect.

What I can say is that a performance car built to these standards, especially as a sedan, is entirely impractical and has almost zero demand in today's world. The 75 year old owners of Ferraris love to tinker with their cars and hit the open road but when it comes to taking the grand kids to church on Sunday, they don't feel like fooling with the eccentricities of Maserati. That's why you can't give these cars away.

The only way you (or I) can see value in these machines is knowing their pedigree and understanding that this technology and performance comes at a price for a reason. If Ferrari didn't understand this, then the Japanese would've put them out of business a long time ago.
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
My service history shows 20 warranty repairs at the dealership, mostly for "fit and finish" type of issues like doors not closing properly, wrong parts installed etc. Still things on it are wrong, like my discovery that the outside scraper seals on both front doors are missing all of their hold-down clips in the middle, and the rear sunshade "hooks" that are supposed to be installed on the topside of the windows are the wrong part -- what I have are not actually hooks, and so do not serve the desired function, rendering the rear sunshades inoperative.

I understand what a great car it is, at a bargain price. But I also know that mine was among the first produced, and for that it had its imperfections.
 
Possibly built on a Friday, Sean ;)

Yours does seem particularly affected. I bought both of mine at the low end of the available market. They both needed work that had been delayed / missed / deferred, but I'll confidently say that none of it was factory installed on either of them.

C
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
Possibly built on a Friday, Sean ;)

Yours does seem particularly affected. I bought both of mine at the low end of the available market. They both needed work that had been delayed / missed / deferred, but I'll confidently say that none of it was factory installed on either of them.

C
In its defense, for all the "fit and finish" problems the car drives like a dream and runs like a clock. So those are really the important things.
 
That is a result of the detail shops. Detailers, including those at the dealerships, use "wheel acid" to clean the wheels. It immediately cleans the wheel inside and out with very little effort. You'll see it at any car wash (and at the dealer) in a 5-gallon bucket with a push-broom size brush and handle. It does an amazing job but after the 15th-20th wash, you'll start to see the fading. Then eventually, the paint will fade, peel and corrosion will start. Mercedes used this for years in the 80s and all the "flat" wheels on the SELs and SLs were stripped of paint by their 5th birthday. This is why I use a mild dish soap and all of the wheels on all of my cars, even after 100s of thousands of miles are like new. AND, I live right on the ocean, where corrosion is the #1 enemy.

Not to defend Maserati with any type of bias, but I'm curious, as a 2005 owner, what missed details you've noticed and what indicates poor assembly.

Keep in mind that your car was assembled using components (electronic and hardware) from various Ferrari cars of that era. For example, your firewall forward parts (windshield wiper assembly, etc.) is right off the 599, as is your entire steering column, cover, etc. Your mirrors are 612. Many buttons and electronic components are from 599, 612 and 430. Your brakes, suspension and power train are pure Ferrari bred and built. Your paint (assuming it is original) is straight Ferrari quality. From a sedan perspective, I equate it to Bentley/RR. Factory wet sanded with slight imperfections inside the door jams indicating hand finishing. All the body lines and gaps are perfect. The interior has incredible visibility and zero dash glare - a huge problem in many cars. Regardless, I can assure you that the factory in which your car was built wasn't composed of jack asses bumping into each other forgetting to tighten screws and paint wheels. Typical deficiencies in used QPs are generally a result of replaced parts and wear caused by various levels of neglect.

What I can say is that a performance car built to these standards, especially as a sedan, is entirely impractical and has almost zero demand in today's world. The 75 year old owners of Ferraris love to tinker with their cars and hit the open road but when it comes to taking the grand kids to church on Sunday, they don't feel like fooling with the eccentricities of Maserati. That's why you can't give these cars away.

The only way you (or I) can see value in these machines is knowing their pedigree and understanding that this technology and performance comes at a price for a reason. If Ferrari didn't understand this, then the Japanese would've put them out of business a long time ago.
I'm going to share this on our FB group, what a fantastic description of the QP!

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 
As part of my 2005 QP wide array of missed details and poor assembly, I think that one of its wheels never received any factory clearcoat. Please see the attached pic of my passenger rear wheel. All the dark patches are pure rust. This is the only wheel on the car that is significantly corroded, the others have only minor pitting at worst, although the driver side rear wheel clearcoat is peeling off bit by bit.

I am going to try and have the rear wheels refinished. I wondered if anyone else has had problems with the factory finish on the wheels.
The car is 12 years old and you automatically assume that it's a factory issue. I've read your other problems as well. You're probably not the original owner (I may be wrong on this). Perhaps repair shops didn't put it back together properly? Wheels may have been refinished? Not everyone religiously brings our machines to highly qualified shops
 
Discussion starter · #8 ·
I am the 3rd owner. I am aware of the maintenance and the general kind of life this car led with its two prior owners. I am acquainted with its 2nd owner who drove it from 9000 miles through 46,000 miles when he sold it to me. I feel it is highly suspicious to have one wheel out of 4 with absolutely no clearcoat on it anywhere, not so much as a fleck. What could a previous owner have done to cause this to happen to just one wheel?

I also feel that having 4 wrong parts installed at the exact location on the rear passenger doors where the sunshade hooks belong could only be a factory issue. This is literally a case of, how did Erik put it, jack asses bumping into each other forgetting to tighten screws and paint wheels. Or in this case, installing 4 incorrect parts from the wrong part bin instead of the sunshade hooks. Reading my warranty repair history, these aren't the only incorrect parts that were installed at the factory. But previous owners never noticed or bothered to have these replaced under warranty.

I don't know why it is so hard for people to accept that this stuff could happen.
 
All of that stuff could happen but it's hard to believe so much could be wrong considering the car is subjected to a rigorous multi day finishing inspection.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk
 
So, back to your wheel corrosion. I actually don't that it is corrosion, but heavy buildup of brake dust . The prior owner(s) probably weren't all that thorough with wheel cleaning. Try using an acid-free wheel cleaner, specifically one of the cleaners like Iron-x that turn purple when in contact with an iron based buildup (i.e. brake dust). It will take multiple applications and then you can followup with with polishing (I prefer 3M rubbing compound).

In the past, I've been able to save most rims, but it generally took me quite a bit of effort over a few weeks...did a little at a time during each detail cycle.

Option B, have a refinisher do them over. Not all that hard, they are just painted alloy. Figure $50 to $100 per rim and I've had substantial results even from the mobile guys, just ask around and you'll find a reputable one.
 
While on the subject of wheel finishes, I'm told the 19" "Ball polished" wheels are actually a painted finish, is this true? I know mine were repaired a few times before my ownership and it leaves me wondering how they are done. I do have corrosion on the center caps, one of these days I will try to sand it down and re-clear.
 
They are definitely painted. You can still have them repaired without a repaint however. If you have road rash, they can polish up the lip and it blends into the painted area almost perfectly.
 
Discussion starter · #13 ·
So, back to your wheel corrosion. I actually don't that it is corrosion, but heavy buildup of brake dust . The prior owner(s) probably weren't all that thorough with wheel cleaning. Try using an acid-free wheel cleaner, specifically one of the cleaners like Iron-x that turn purple when in contact with an iron based buildup (i.e. brake dust). It will take multiple applications and then you can followup with with polishing (I prefer 3M rubbing compound).

In the past, I've been able to save most rims, but it generally took me quite a bit of effort over a few weeks...did a little at a time during each detail cycle.

Option B, have a refinisher do them over. Not all that hard, they are just painted alloy. Figure $50 to $100 per rim and I've had substantial results even from the mobile guys, just ask around and you'll find a reputable one.
Heavy buildup of brake dust? I think you must be kidding. I have used a good all-purpose cleaner on this crap more than once and nothing comes off, if you see it up close it is obviously just rusty old exposed metal. I'm sorry my picture is a bit blurry, it doesn't do it justice. You would have to see it to believe it, it is pure galvanic corrosion. I am actually concerned that it can never be repaired so I will have to replace the wheel. I think parts of the Titanic are still in better condition, honestly.
 
Discussion starter · #14 ·
Hold on now, are you saying that heavy brake dust can mimic the appearance of a rust spot, because it is an iron-based build-up? Hmm.... I will keep an open mind as I pursue a solution. I have honestly never seen a patch of brake dust that didn't start to dissolve on contact with a good all-purpose cleaner or wheel cleaner.
 
He could have had a wheel refinished from curb rash, etc. He could also have had a Minot accident that required parts to be replaced. I'm not saying that this is definitely the case. But I find that concluding that these things happened from the factory and are being noticed over 10 years later to be more of a stretch. If you took possession of a six figure car, would you not notice these things quickly?
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
Try iron-x I can't see how the wheels can be rusty. Aren't they alloy?

C
I washed it today, and verified that it is just rock-solid rust. No matter what I scrape it with, it doesn't come off. I'm staring at rusty metal. I wouldn't have believed it but it looks like a rusty piece of iron. The wheel itself has no paint or clearcoat on it at all, it is just polished metal. I mean, the parts that aren't rusty.

I will update here after I've visited the wheel refinishers and see what they have to say.
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
He could have had a wheel refinished from curb rash, etc. He could also have had a Minot accident that required parts to be replaced. I'm not saying that this is definitely the case. But I find that concluding that these things happened from the factory and are being noticed over 10 years later to be more of a stretch. If you took possession of a six figure car, would you not notice these things quickly?
I happen to know that both previous owners were old men in poor health, they didn't have time or patience to fuss over things like how shiny things look. And in the end, a ball-polished alloy wheel with no clearcoat looks identical to one with clearcoat -- until the lack of clearcoat betrays itself by failing to protect the finish.
 
You do realize that Maserati neither manufactures nor finishes the wheels. They are ordered from a supplier. At the risk of upsetting you, I still feel that something happened to the car subsequent to delivery and it wasn't put back together again properly.
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
You do realize that Maserati neither manufactures nor finishes the wheels. They are ordered from a supplier. At the risk of upsetting you, I still feel that something happened to the car subsequent to delivery and it wasn't put back together again properly.
It is certainly possible that many treatments of detailing have first stripped the wheel of its clearcoat (the other rear wheel is peeling but still has the majority intact), and then the corrosion started because of excess brake dust. I also learned that the use of PunctureSeal etc. to fix a flat can cause wheel corrosion to set in, which could explain the appearance of the one wheel in relation to the others.
 
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