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Discussion Starter #1
How many people on the forums are aware of \ involved with \ interested in The Maserati Club?

I have been discussing starting a midwest \ minnesota chapter with the club leaders, but I am a bit surprised with their somewhat low membership numbers, and minimal participation from modern Maser owners.

(They estimate membership in the 1000 range worldwide, with about 70% in the US)

They do put out an excellent magazine, calendar, and newsletter (the mag and calendar are worth the ~$65/yr membership).

Their website is in the process of being re-done, but the old version is at http://www.themaseraticlub.com/

They primarily focus on the vintage models now, but are in the process of really trying to bring modern model owners in. I had a nice conversation with the chairman of the club, and I'd like to get some feedback from the forums about the club and how much interest there is.

- Mark
 

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excellent mag. great social club. some of us were at the spartanburg euro auto festival two week ago. like to get more members so we can interact better and strengthen the brand. are we not all enthusiasts?
 

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I checked out the California website last year. It looks like nothing has been added or chaged there since 2004. Not a great endorsement. It's a shame because the Porsche Club is great.
 

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Flash intro points out TX but when I enter website no information about a TX chapter.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The 2006 calendar lists an eastern chapter, southeastern chapter, rocky mountain, california, ontario, japan, australia, south african, hungary, and italian chapters.

TMC was formed from merging three primarily US based clubs. Unlike some of the other clubs, there is not as much national organization \ overhead, it is almost entirely run by the local chapters.

There is a lot of room for growth \ development, and I am probably going to be volunteering a lot of my time to do what I can to start a chapter here in the midwest, as well as help the club attract more modern Maserati owners.
 

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maserati of minneapolis said:
The 2006 calendar lists an eastern chapter, southeastern chapter, rocky mountain, california, ontario, japan, australia, south african, hungary, and italian chapters.

TMC was formed from merging three primarily US based clubs. Unlike some of the other clubs, there is not as much national organization \ overhead, it is almost entirely run by the local chapters.

There is a lot of room for growth \ development, and I am probably going to be volunteering a lot of my time to do what I can to start a chapter here in the midwest, as well as help the club attract more modern Maserati owners.
First as an FYI there are actually 2 Maserati Clubs in North America. Neither is a Club in the tradional sense, (as in elected clubs officers, accountability to the membership etc).

TMC's origin comes from the Old Maserati Club of America (when it was actually a club) which was East Coast based. It merged with smaller clubs in Canada, Colorado & California. While it does produce a very nice high quality magazine, they actually do only about 1 issue per year. Their overall membership is nowhere near 1,000 members. They have 1 major event a year (MaserMiglia) a touring drive held in a different part of the country each year. On average maybe 15 Maseratis attend.

The other "Club" is Maserati Club International (MCI) - which is much older and larger. Founded in the mid 1970's it has about 3,000 + members. It is part of MIE Corp (Maserati Information Exchange) a Maserati Parts business, Concorso Italiano was also part of this business group. (In the last 4 years all 3 enities were sold off with MCI & MIE staying together and Concorso Italiano being sold to a seperate individual.) MCI produces an equally high quality magazine VCM (Via Ciro Menotti) twice a year plus an impressive hardbound version once a year. It holds 2 major events per year one on the West Coast at Concorso Italiano called Maserati Days. Over 60 Maseratis participate. The other is on the East Coast at Le Belle Macchine d'Italia - The Maserati Owners National Meet & Historic Maserati Reunion. This event always features rare historic Maseratis. Last year it brought together 2 - 450S', 3 Bircages, a 300S, 200Si, all 3 1938 Maserati 8CTFs ever built for the 1st time since 1948 including the 1939 & 40 Indy 500 winning Boyle Special, plus the oldest unrestored Maserati in the world a 1928 Tipo 26B.

Each club has a number of regional chapters. As would be expected for many years there has been a lot of bad blood between the clubs. A 3rd indpendent Maserati Club -The So Cal based MOCNA (Maserati Owners Club of North America) was split apart during this 'War" with the membership joining each of the rival clubs.

The bad blood was really an ego war between 2 individuals. Since the sale of MCI/MIE and meeting the new owner, many long time Maserati owners have choosen to rejoin a Maserati Club again by joining MCI.

The bad news is that one of the egos still remains involved on the TMC side. The good news a number of members of both clubs have become sick of it all and have begun working together. Specifically in California, however in other parts of the country such as the Northeast even though a number of members have tried, certain individuals on the TMC side are keeping the clubs from working together.

That is a quick overview of the Maserati Club status in North America. Many would like to form a single structured national club with elections, but a few people are preventing it in order to hang on to their individual fiefdoms.

For what it is worth my personal preference is for Maserat Club International, it is larger and offers more to member. (Of course you could always join both).

In the interest of full desclosure: I am a 20 + year owner of Maseratis having now owned 11 of them. I was member the National Board of Directors of The Maserati Club of America. I am the organizer of Le Belle Macchine d'Italia which hosts the Maserati Owenrs National Meet & Historic Maserati Reunion.

Joe
Ghibli SS # 2110
Khamsin # 1226
Mistral # 1216
Bora # 1046
Islero # 6243
Lele Marlboro # 184
Mondial Cab # 49713
Laforza # 159
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Thanks for the reply. All of the info I have was from the Chairman of TMC, who seems like a nice enough guy, but the fact that there isn't much national organization, and its left to the chapters to basically do their own thing worries me a bit. He also didn't mention anything about the 'war'.

So now I'm curious. If I want to get something going here for local members and enthusiasts, what do you think is the best route to go?
 

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I would echo Joe's comments. I live about 5 miles from MIE/MCI. Kerry McMullen is a very stand up guy and great to work with. He has been a die hard supporter of the Italian Concours here in Washington State, and is doing all he can to restore the great name of Maserati in the USA.

The club is great to belong to. Like Joe said, the VCM publication is fantastic. It has won numerous awards over the year, and the hardbound (once a year) publications are BEAUTIFUL!

Part prices are more reasonable then back in the "old days", and the staff (Stuart and Jeff) are extremely knowledgeable on the older GT cars and friendly to deal with.

Mike
Board of Directors
Italian Concours d' Elegance
http://www.italianconcours.org
'80 Maserati 4Porte
'83 Lamborghini Jalpa
'91 Alfa Romeo 164L
'04 Aprilia Futura
 

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The Maserati Club...

Hello all !!!

It is a pleasure to join this forum..I have been viewing it for some time.

I was very interested in some of the comments regarding the Maserati club situation in the US. As we all know there are two: TMC and MCI. Both have their loyal following. Both organizations have had leadership changes in the past year or two, the new owner at MIE and the new chairman at TMC. Both put out quality publications (MIE-Viale Ciro Menotti and TMC-iL Tridente and their Newsletter iL Nettuno). Both clubs have events they participate in and in some cases they participate together. I am a member of both!

I should also mention that I am the North American President of TMC. Together with our Chairman, Gary Sisson, we are in the process of revamping TMC, something every organization needs now and then. We are a club of volunteers who donate our time and efforts in club matters, such as our new website, which we are working on and should have up and running soon. Those who have seen our magazine (iL Tridente) know it to be a top notch magazine. Recently, we have removed much of the US Chapter news from this magazine and placed it in our new quarterly Newsletter (iL Nettuno). This newsletter is available online to club members only.

TMC is a confederation of chapters where control is based at the local chapter level. This was done by design, as there is no doubt that local control can better serve its immediate membership. The chapter dues stay at the local level where they can benefit local members. TMC does have an international board of directors to assist with chapter coordination where necessary, iL Tridente for example, and our annual Maser Miglia event, which was held in Venice, Italy, this past May. Not all our chapters have elections, but we certainly encourage our members to participate in club/chapter leadership if they wish to.

So what does this mean for Maserati owners? As a Maserati owner I decided to join both clubs. I like MIE for the parts (member discount included) and service. They have always had the parts I have needed. I like TMC for the local events. In the TMC:Southeast Chapter (which I am also president of), we participate in at least three local events and our National Maser Miglia event, which we will host for 2007. Since my move to TN, I am always looking for additional events where we can participate. If there are other Maserati enthusiasts/owners in the Southeast, please let me know, especially if you know of a nice event that Maserati owners would like.

Maserati owners don't have to make a choice! Both clubs have their good attributes! Join both and get the best of both worlds..

Michael A. Demyanovich
1985 Biturbo
1982 QPIII
1975 Khamsin
1972 Ghibli SS
1967 Mexico
1967 QPI
1964 Mistral
New Maserati (not YET!!)
 

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How do you get current info on the Club? The website has a registration for the 2005 MilleMaser and it looks as if everything else halted in mid 2005. The latest post I can find is in June of that year.
 

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Jalpa_Mike said:
I would echo Joe's comments. I live about 5 miles from MIE/MCI. Kerry McMullen is a very stand up guy and great to work with. He has been a die hard supporter of the Italian Concours here in Washington State, and is doing all he can to restore the great name of Maserati in the USA.
Ditto and ditto. Very nice people, met them at the Concours. I'm a MCI member.
 

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The Maserati Club (website)...

There is no doubt that the TMC website is woefully out of date...
As with most(?) club websites we had to rely on one person to keep the thing up-to-date...Unfortunately, such a task can be overwhelming, especially since we rely on volunteers!! And to be quite frank, the colors don't always help.. I can barely read the site myself.

With the change in our leadership, we are looking for new ways of doing things.

That being said, our new Chairman, Gary Sisson, from Denver, has begun working on a complete revamp (also known as 'new') of the TMC website. One of the things we are striving for is to allow each chapter the capability of updating its own content.. We have a lot of work to complete and I can't project the release date. But at our Maser Miglia event, we showed some of our members a preview and they were quite enthused.

In the meantime, I would recommend you contact the individuals who are the heads of the local chapter, they can be found on the current website. We all have events planned and coming up. These are typically listed in our newsletter, called 'iL Nettuno'. If you are not a member of TMC, you do not automatically get this. But if you check with any of the chapter heads, they would be more than happy to send you info on upcoming events.

I hope this helps!!

Michael A. Demyanovich
TMC:North American President
TMC:Southeast Chapter President
 

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Steeldream said:
How do you get current info on the Club? The website has a registration for the 2005 MilleMaser and it looks as if everything else halted in mid 2005. The latest post I can find is in June of that year.
Bingo buddy!

TMC has chapters in various parts of the country as does MCI.
On the west coast the two work well together on events.

The so called war is in the minds of a few people but unfortunately they still call a lot of the shots in spite of all protestations about how things are changing.

They are not and probably will not.

Most of us want to just enjoy our cars and go to friendly engaging events. The Maser Millie event is one such event that seems to work pretty well but it's a big commitment for most people. We need local events as well.

The TMC magazine is similar in that regard. Very pretty, nicely done and quite interesting. But it's of very little relevance to most Maserati owners. The focus is wrong for most club members.

Here in the northeast the TMC club is dead and has been for quite a few years. In part this goes back to the stupid "war" thing but there also has been a consistent lack of good organization here and when someone does "join" the board and start doing some good things invariably they are booted out. Then we are back to restaurant events, opera visits and the like.
That's why I stopped attending.

The closest MCI chapter is in Pittsburgh and that's just too far away. For the last 6 months good faith efforts have been made by the closest MCI chapter rep to rectify this situation. We wanted to plan joint events for the upcoming year as attendance of Maseratis at events here in the northeast is embarrassing.

Recently, the northeast TMC rep Charles Roy suggested that a number of us
meet at the fall Hershey event as he was going to be there. So some of us
took a couple of days, got motel rooms and went there in what is a great car atmosphere. We get there and he answers his cell phone and says yes he will
meet us later in the day.

After 2 days of phoning and messages we got stiffed. He has since returned no phone calls or emails. What does that sound like?

If you can't attend a meeting you set up and then refuse to explain it later
I don't know what to say. Perhaps he got and is deathly ill I don't know.
Does anyone know what happened to Charles Roy? He seemed to be able to send out invitations to another restaurant trip in October.

Yeah, things are changing.

I wish these guys would just get over that stupid chip on their shoulders and come join us for fun. I miss some of them. Some.

If the rest of the country can do it what's their problem?

Bottom line, do join MCI and TMC as well, I guess, but not in the northeast.

Just so there is no confusion about either of these "clubs" neither is a club.
You don't get to elect anyone. It works more like middle east politics for TMC
and MCI is a company that provides a great magazine and a subscriber database.

Bob S.
 

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staatsof said:
Bingo buddy!

TMC has chapters in various parts of the country as does MCI.
On the west coast the two work well together on events.

The so called war is in the minds of a few people but unfortunately they still call a lot of the shots in spite of all protestations about how things are changing.

They are not and probably will not.

Most of us want to just enjoy our cars and go to friendly engaging events. The Maser Millie event is one such event that seems to work pretty well but it's a big commitment for most people. We need local events as well.

The TMC magazine is similar in that regard. Very pretty, nicely done and quite interesting. But it's of very little relevance to most Maserati owners. The focus is wrong for most club members.

Here in the northeast the TMC club is dead and has been for quite a few years. In part this goes back to the stupid "war" thing but there also has been a consistent lack of good organization here and when someone does "join" the board and start doing some good things invariably they are booted out. Then we are back to restaurant events, opera visits and the like.
That's why I stopped attending.

The closest MCI chapter is in Pittsburgh and that's just too far away. For the last 6 months good faith efforts have been made by the closest MCI chapter rep to rectify this situation. We wanted to plan joint events for the upcoming year as attendance of Maseratis at events here in the northeast is embarrassing.

Recently, the northeast TMC rep Charles Roy suggested that a number of us
meet at the fall Hershey event as he was going to be there. So some of us
took a couple of days, got motel rooms and went there in what is a great car atmosphere. We get there and he answers his cell phone and says yes he will
meet us later in the day.

After 2 days of phoning and messages we got stiffed. He has since returned no phone calls or emails. What does that sound like?

If you can't attend a meeting you set up and then refuse to explain it later
I don't know what to say. Perhaps he got and is deathly ill I don't know.
Does anyone know what happened to Charles Roy? He seemed to be able to send out invitations to another restaurant trip in October.

Yeah, things are changing.

I wish these guys would just get over that stupid chip on their shoulders and come join us for fun. I miss some of them. Some.

If the rest of the country can do it what's their problem?

Bottom line, do join MCI and TMC as well, I guess, but not in the northeast.

Just so there is no confusion about either of these "clubs" neither is a club.
You don't get to elect anyone. It works more like middle east politics for TMC
and MCI is a company that provides a great magazine and a subscriber database.

Bob S.
Bob,
I agree that while it is nice to hear that there are changes happening at TMC. But unless someone in that club gets a backbone and they finally get rid of the person that has caused all the problems, they will never be a viable Maserati Club.

Your comments on the current President of the East Chapter, Charles Roy sound familiar. When it was announced that he was the new President and things were changing at TMC, I was encouraged by a couple of TMC members to call him and invite the club to the Maserati Owners National Meet & Historic Reunion at Le Belle Macchine d'Italia.

I did and spoke with him for about a half an hour, it was very cordial. I was completely up front with him on past differences with TMC and told him that we were interested in putting that behind us and starting fresh. He told me he agreed and didn’t see why it couldn’t happen. We ended on a positive note and that he would get back to me in few days after he met with the rest of his board. That was in June, I still haven’t heard back from him.

It is apparent that he is not running the club, just like the President before him. They are just puppets on a string. The person that has destroyed and split apart the Maserati Community in North America appears to still be running things at TMC. This is the same person that was responsible for the disaster at Monterey in 2000.

That is the reason the club’s membership is dwindling at a time when it should be expanding. I know many long time Maserati owners that won’t even consider joining TMC as long as he is associated with it and a number of current members that will not be renewing because of him.

Unfortunately TMC has become an ego driven personality cult. When the leadership of TMC refuses to inform its members about the 2 largest Maserati events in North America, there is a problem. When there is a gathering of historic Maseratis that hasn’t taken place for 58 years, or when the largest display ever of the most revered Maserati in history (450S) takes place and neither is covered in iL Tridente (after all its focus is on the historic racing Maseratis), there is a problem. This is supposed to be a club about Maseratis, Right?

I wish both Mike & Gary good luck in their attempts to revive TMC. Unfortunately unless they stand up and make some real changes by removing the source of the problems from their club, things are not going to change.

It is time that the Maserati Community came together for the common love of Maseratis and was not split apart by the ego of one individual.

Joe
 

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The Maserati Club...

It looks like we can all agree that there are personality(?) issues when it comes to the Maserati situation in the Northeast. Things will take time to resolve.. After all, the situation didn't develop overnight! It happened over time.. That's all I think I should say on this at this time...

What I find interesting is that most feel that TMC and MIE are not clubs? Perhaps you are right, but it may not be so simple. I will go out on a limb here and say that is probably true for MIE, having been a member there for almost 20 years. That is probably not in their business plan, or club plan, to the best of my knowledge. Now, I don't mean this negative!! For the last 20 years or so, I payed my dues, got my good magazine, and bought discounted parts. I was and am happy. Not until recently (last 5 years ?), did MIE branch out to the other regions outside of California and the Northwest. I am not sure what support, namely financial, the regions receive from the MIE dues you and I have paid. And being in the Southeast, there is one event that I am aware of that MIE participates in...But again, this may be different in other regions.

As for TMC, we know we have problems! And we really are trying to rectify them. Some of the chapters have tried to have elections and in some cases like the Rocky Mountain Chapter, it actually works, as the leadership positions are rotated around. In the Southeast, I once tried to have elections and solicited nominations for President. Unfortunately, no one wanted the job. Not surprising in this day and age! We know everyone is busy. I know there are times I would rather be a member vs a chapter president because it's a LOT of work! But we are a club of volunteers where the power and money stays at the local level. And I have to admit I kind of like that! If TMC:SE is at an event like ItaliaFest or what was the Portafino event, and members attended with their cars, I think it's right to have some TMC paraphanalia to give them, or buy lunch if appropriate. We shouldn't have to check with some national organization. The dues were paid locally and should be accounted for locally. That's how TMC is supposed to operate and we are striving to attain this.

I realize we have more work to do in relation to the Northeast. And all I can tell you is we will do our best to work on it. But it will take time! I will be calling for a meeting of the TMC North American Chapter Presidents sometime before the holidays to discuss numerous issues.

By the way...I'm not sure most of you know this, but George Perfect is now the editor and head of iL Tridente, the TMC publication. Many of you know George, and both Gary (TMC Chairman) and I are looking forward to working closely with him. We are expecting our next edition shortly along with our 2007 calendar. Doug Magnon, our TMC:California chapter President had indicated the next edition of our newsletter, iL Nettuno, will be out within a week or two. We were delayed due to Doug's recent accident, but he is doing well now, and we all wish him a speedy and full recovery.

I know this post is long but I think it is important that I let members of this forum know what we are trying to do at TMC and what we stand for. I do hope we will also get some input from MIE. I don't know this, but is there a thread for MIE in the MaseratiLife forum? As an MIE member I would like to hear some of the things they are up to as well...

Michael A. Demyanovich
TMC:North American President
TMC:Southeast Chapter President
 

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Discussion Starter #17
First off;

Mike, welcome to the Forums.

Secondly; WOW. I didn't realize what I was getting into with this thread. I hope some good comes of it though.

I am already planning events, some in cooperation with the local Ferrari club, as they now have a new leader here in MN, whom I've worked with quite a bit over the last couple of years. I already have some events in the planning stages, and I'd really like to reach out to the vintage owners, but is there a good way to go about this without alienating either side? I'd really like to avoid getting in the middle of old bad blood.

- Mark
 

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mexico074 said:
It looks like we can all agree that there are personality(?) issues when it comes to the Maserati situation in the Northeast. Things will take time to resolve.. After all, the situation didn't develop overnight! It happened over time.. That's all I think I should say on this at this time.......

..............I realize we have more work to do in relation to the Northeast. And all I can tell you is we will do our best to work on it. But it will take time! I will be calling for a meeting of the TMC North American Chapter Presidents sometime before the holidays to discuss numerous issues.



Michael A. Demyanovich
TMC:North American President
TMC:Southeast Chapter President
Mike,
It is very encouraging to read your post, and I do believe that you would honestly like to change things at TMC. While I understand why you may think that you need time to change things, but this isn't the first time this situation has happened in the Northeast.

Back in the early 90's when the club was known as the Maserati Club of America. The then Board Members said the exact same thing about needing time to straighten things out because of the last "Never Elected President for Life". They all agreed that something needed to be done, but kept putting off doing anything until a couple of Board Members got a backbone and had enough. That person was removed from his position immediately and his association with the club was terminated. And the club was the better for it.

Unfortunately it wasn’t 5 years later that the same Board members that kept delaying taking action allowed the current ‘Never Elected President for Life” to hijack the club. Those of us that stood up against the last ego driven individual ruining the club, quit in disgust at it being allowed to happen again.

While I still owned numerous Maseratis, I would not join either club for 10 years. Not until MCI was sold and I got to know Kerry McMullen. He helped renewed my enthusiasm for Maserati and I have since purchased 3 more.

I annually attend the Monterey weekend where both California Chapters of MCI & TMC participate in Maserati Days together as if they were one club. I have spoken at length with Doug Magnon the TMC Calif. Chapter President on the subject of the clubs working together and we basically agree that it should happen. As Bob said a number of MCI & TMC people recently tried.

But it won’t happen until the problem in the Northeast is removed. Please don’t take this the wrong way, but it doesn’t take time. It takes action and Board members with the Backbone to say enough, you have ruined this club and it is time for you to go! Just like it was done 15 years ago.

Joe
PS Yes I was aware of George's position with il Tridente, I also spoke with him at the various Maserati functions at Monterey.
 

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For those of you in the northeast I'm sure you are already aware of most of this situation but for the others I will explain a bit and just a bit. Then I will make my case for change.

Joe Corbacio, a.k.a. italiacars and Seymour Pond hate each others guts.

They were involved in a forced marriage of sorts for an annual car event in the Pocono Mountains. They event was split in 2 well really more like 1/4 and 3/4 as a result of this. The 2 events are now held a month apart with each group of organizers doing what it can to make the other event fail. Why?

Well because of the hate but also because they need each other back together. Now it's really a lot more complicated that how I just described it
but think of that as the Cliff notes version. (For those of you on the inner circle of this hate fest, no pun intended).

Bottom line, the earlier event needs to go away. It's very small and crap draws more flies than this event does exotics and in particular Maseratis.
I'm sorry if that sounds harsh but it's a fact. It will never go completely away because it's basically a Corvette, Jag and Mustang etc. event with 2 days of track.

The later event also has trouble drawing Maseratis from everyday folk but Joe Corbacio has produced an impressive group of vintage race cars several years in a row. But we need to get the "club" members back together.

If you are in the northeast and have stayed away from the late June event because of this stupid feud then you are only cheating yourself out of seeing some of the most spectacular collections of Maserati racers.

So is this what a "club" is supposed to do for it's members?

Not promote local Maserati events and intercede when efforts are made to bring the "clubs" together locally for events like this?

On the west coast that would be like TMC not listing or organizing any efforts around Concourso Italiano because it was founded by Fran Mandarano. That used happen with the now dead club MOCNA. It just makes no sense.

I've been going to these Pocono events since the mid 1990's and last year was the first time I missed one due to other commitments. I can see what's happening.

I know both of these individuals and each has done good things for Maserati.
I don't hate or dislike either of them but I don't like the way they do things some times. So what. There is a great event here in late June and we should all be pulling together for that and other outings, not telling people where not to go and who not to work with.

I read Mike's explanation of how things are changing and I remember having numerous emails with Seymour about this earlier in the year. He had the same excuse for the lack of elections and then said he was stepping down and taking a lesser role.

The hate and obstruction continues none the less.

Perhaps the the other chapters of TMC can intercede and clean house here in the northeast. I've heard the first hand accounts from former board members and everyone needs to go. Their results speak for themselves.

Everyone.

As "club" members we can't vote them out so that's our only hope.

And that was the "short" version! More than enough.

Bob S.
 

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Mark,

This thread got hijacked but I think your working with the local Ferrari club is a great idea. That's the time proven approach, using other Italian car clubs. I don't know your demographics out there but in smaller areas we usually link up with Lamborghini, Iso, and others as well. The lambo thing might be tough for you though.

You won't be getting into any controversy with MCI and hopefully TMC will fix their northeast problem and join the rest of the car community. Then it will be one big happy family. Most vintage Maserati owners subscribe to MIE as it's a very good resource. So you can probably contact Kerry to promote your event but do it very early!

Bob S.


maserati of minneapolis said:
First off;

Mike, welcome to the Forums.

Secondly; WOW. I didn't realize what I was getting into with this thread. I hope some good comes of it though.

I am already planning events, some in cooperation with the local Ferrari club, as they now have a new leader here in MN, whom I've worked with quite a bit over the last couple of years. I already have some events in the planning stages, and I'd really like to reach out to the vintage owners, but is there a good way to go about this without alienating either side? I'd really like to avoid getting in the middle of old bad blood.

- Mark
 
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