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Hello
I am by far no expert on these cars but have spent the last 8 months trying to figure this out.
the only pavement this car has seen in 8 months is from the back of a tow truck.

i want to make this clear that I am in no way disagreeing with any information people are posting on here as this is all good information and this may only help other people on this form
there has been many Maserati experts look at this car and could not find any issues.
I have tried many things and it’s too much to post as I do have lots of experience on cars just not the f1 system on Maserati

I am thinking that all the potentiometers need to collaborate with each other to make sure that everything is in sync with the computer to not throw a code if the potentiometer on the gas pedal increases and it doesn’t see anything from the speed sensor it would automatically throw an F1 sensor code as it thinks there’s a problem with the gearbox or clutch I think there is multiple things that would trigger the F1 sensor code.

all information is good in some way and everything on here is great brain food.
thanks
 

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Yeah that's right, all the sensors cross reference with other sensors so some codes will come about due to disagreement. The sensors on the actuator have an expected max/min range for each gear, so if one of the shafts isn't rotating correctly (such as a broken pin or failed seals) then those sensors will throw an error from being out of range and shut off the engine.

I'm keen to help you get the car running.
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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Hi Savage ,
Yes this is the sucker !!!
Clean everything inside and pull out the rest of the pin put it togehter an messure the Diameter and lenght.Make shure that the pin is slightly shorter,the outer cylinder moves in the housing .If it is to long it will stuck.
After all put Molykote grease in it. I hope you have marked the gearfork .If not there is a Special tool for adjusting and testing , maybe you can lend it.
The bleeding for the actuatoris easy.
Connect all pipes with new coppergaskets. Fill the Reservoire and pull out the 3 bleeding screws completely one after a another and let gravity do it`s work.
Put everything together , clutch bleeding if needed selfearning and a test ride.

Good luck Frank
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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Lenght 25.3mm Diameter 5.05mm , This is the pin we use , diameter is ok but you must shorten it.Coolant spray is helpfull for mounting the pin.
 

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Discussion Starter #46 (Edited)
Today I drove down the road as immedately the Engine light and the CC symbol came on.

Fortunely the Engine don´t went off, so I could pull over and turn it off by myself.

I hoped turning it off and on would solve the issue and I could move on. But I couldn´t start the engine anymore.... I was stucked and some guys had to help to move the car to a safe position....

So now I have both lamps on, Engine and CC. The CC light blinks sometimes, but after restart the CC will stay on permanetly.

Also sometimes the engine just turn and don´t fire up, sometimes it fire up and will run for 30sec or some munites and then it will turn off by itself. And sometimes the engine won´t even turn.

The same situation with a jumper cable, so it´s not the battery. It´s also already new.

Meanwhile I bought the scanner mentioned a few post ago, but it´s not covering Maserati... But I managed to read out the car with a generic OBD reader and get the following codes:

-P1586
-P1602
-P806
-P0808

After deleting them I got P1586, P1602 and P0808 back. P0806 is not coming back until now.

My research regarding the codes brings me to a faulty clutch position sensor (P0806 and 0808). Is that right?

I would need any suggestion regarding a obd scanner which will definetly work and also any advice regarding the codes or my situation is welcome.

Will appreciate any help.

Thank you guys.

Edit: I still hear the pump when I open the car or the driver door...
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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P1602 should not come back , it’s only written when you disconnect the battery .
P0808/0806 seems a faulty F1 sensor .
P1586 is throttle related .
 

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Discussion Starter #48
Has the 4200 already a E-throttle so that the sensor could go bad? Or is it a old fashioned one with a cable?

I´m asking because the P1586 could be a fault which is caused by the others and not really something faulty?!

Regarding the F1 Sensor I need to unbolt the gearbox complete and take it of my car? Or is there anyway to change it with the gearbox/clutch in the car?
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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As i can say you must unbolt the clutchhousing , that means grande casino , gearbox and muffler must out .
The gearbox must not completely out , at the 4200 you can push it backwards .
Some guys say they can change the sensor trough the hole underneath in the clutchhousing .
Would bring a seat and give 500€ for the show .
I say it’s impossible.
The throttle is full drive by wire , but maybe its a fault sent from the TCU to the ECU by the faulty F1 sensor .
 

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Discussion Starter #50 (Edited)
Thank you for your reply.

This is what I feared.... Is there any instructions on the web where I can found some information? For example the specs which bolt get´s which torque etc.?! Or any instructions?

Also I have to ask: If I detach the clutch and see it´s in good condition or was already replaced, could I just change the sensor and bolt everything together?

So the question is: Do I need a scan tool for this job if I wouldn´t change the clutch?

As i can say you must unbolt the clutchhousing , that means grande casino , gearbox and muffler must out .
The gearbox must not completely out , at the 4200 you can push it backwards .
Some guys say they can change the sensor trough the hole underneath in the clutchhousing .
Would bring a seat and give 500€ for the show .
I say it’s impossible.
The throttle is full drive by wire , but maybe its a fault sent from the TCU to the ECU by the faulty F1 sensor .
In the first sentence you mean the gearbox must come out, in the second it can be pushed backwards?! :) So which bolts/components I have to loose to do so? Unbolt and moving backwards sounds much more time efficent than to take the complete box out.

As I see under your nickname you are also from Germany? Do you have a shop?

Edit: I have also another question in mind. The F1 clutch sensor is a hall sensor. So it should work or not, digital 0 and 1... but sometimes the car works fine and sometimes I can´t even start it...
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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You can in the 4200 series push the gearbox backwards . If you lift the engine at the front so the flywheelside is down , you can put out the central tube .
Yes i have a shop in my hometown .
F1 sensor failing is nearly the only opportunity , that the F1 cars will stall i think, maybe fatal throwoutbearing failiure will be the other reason.
If the cluth does not engage , the car won`t start.
 

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Discussion Starter #52
You can in the 4200 series push the gearbox backwards . If you lift the engine at the front so the flywheelside is down , you can put out the central tube .
Yes i have a shop in my hometown .
F1 sensor failing is nearly the only opportunity , that the F1 cars will stall i think, maybe fatal throwoutbearing failiure will be the other reason.
If the cluth does not engage , the car won`t start.
So where is your hometown? :) Maybe near Munich?

So, if I have another issue for example F1 Relais/Pump, worn clutch or anything else the car would start but I would have issues to put in gear and/or move it right?

I´m still a little bit curios why the car starts, runs fine, shifting fine and from one moment to the other the engine is off and I can´t move the car anymore.

Also I´m wondering why the car sometime starts when this happen, runs a several time and then shuts off. Sometimes it shuts off right after firing up and sometimes there is no clicking noise or anything and the engine won´t turn or the starter clicking.

Because of the different behavior and the fact that the situation is not always present I can´t still believe it´s the sensor. If the sensor is gone the situation should always be the same?!
 

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Maserati Quattroporte 4 Evolutione V8 silver/black advanced engine management 415 HP
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To aswer this Question you must read the life data.
If the Clutch is not open and gear in neutral the car won`t start, you will will not even hear a click , the TCU will not give the permission to start the engine.
If you have all codes cleared , wich one is coming back ?
If it is P0808/0806 it`s intermittend i believe , and if not present , the car will run.
 

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You can diagnose that with the scantools. But generally the pump should not run more than once every 60 seconds. If it runs more than that either the accumulator or the solenoids are pooched. If the pump runs for longer than 5 seconds the pump is pooched.
 

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Discussion Starter #56
The pump is running about 5 seconds after unlocking. but then I don´t hear it again with ignition on and engine off. Normal?
 

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If you wait ~5 minutes you should hear it cycle again. It's a lot easier to diagnose with a scanner as you can directly read the system pressure.
 

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I saw you post the OBD codes on the other forum - it sounds like there is some faulty wiring issues. Possibly a faulty crank position sensor, loose positive terminal, faulty F1 sensor. Take it from me - diagnose and test before buying parts. The car is simple, but you will need the correct scan tool to proceed.
 
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As far as the clutch position sensor...There are several years you can change the thing without taking the car apart best I remember..I want to say there is an early and late bellhousing for a M138 and M139 car...I know I have an old sensor that I extended the leads by like 10 inches as a test unit and could install it no problem for testing...Just haven't needed it in like 6 years...Jason
 

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My clutch position sensor was replaced via the clutch inspection hole. Mine is a 2004
 
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