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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Thinking about getting these 3 piece OZ Superleggera III Forged wheels either in a 19" or 20" for my 4200CC

Not got any weight data but they're supposed to be very light compared to stock.

With this in mind, is the ride quality likely to be absolutely ruined if I go for the 20" version? Cant see much written here about benefits, disbenefits of 20s.

Looking at lowering it with Formula Dynamics spings at the same time.



 

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I have stock 19's on my 06 GS Spyder. You do have to be very careful around potholes and driveways. There is no sidewall protecting the rims.

I do feel the roadway more than I need to, but that may be due to the Spyder's somwehat flexible body compared to the suspension setting.

If your car is a daily driver, my guess would be that 19's and certainly 20's are not the best choice. If it's a nice-day coupe, then by all means 19's could work.
 

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19's are a definate!

for that money spend a few more bucks nd get some HRE's...
647R brushed (pictured) look good on that car
compared to O.Z. i think you'll get less vibration at high speeds.

my 2 pennies!

have fun
 

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19's are a definate!

for that money spend a few more bucks nd get some HRE's...
647R brushed (pictured) look good on that car
compared to O.Z. i think you'll get less vibration at high speeds.

my 2 pennies!

have fun
beware. OZ is now owned by TireRack, most of their wheels are no longer made in Italy.

HRE's are known for having very soft outer rims and WILL BEND on you. Viper club has banned them from club racing. Porsche Club America usually won't allow them to pass tech inspection for doing DE days.

When looking for aftermarket wheels, talk to an EXPERT shop, don't trust what you read on the internet!!!

Your brakes/tires/wheels are the most important pieces on your car as they are what connect you to the ground! Don't settle for a product of lesser quality than stock OE. I work in this industry and spend most of my time trying to educate the general public to these issues. Just because a company makes a product that looks pretty and fits on their show Ferrari or Lamborghini doesn't mean it's a quality product!

1. Make sure they are TUV or JWL approved for your application (US DOT stamp is a joke). If specific tests weren't done for your application and load rating, it's not safe to use, period.

2. Overall weight isn't always as important as where the weight is in the wheel (weight optimization).

3. Each manuf. process has certain characteristics. Be careful of what you buy, don't just buy what others on a forum have said works great for them
i.e. Fikse and HRE use a rotary forging process (similar to rolling out pizza dough). This creates a circular grain structure across the entire wheel. Great for the outer lip (impact resistance) but the opposite of what you want for the inner spokes (across the spoke instead of running with it). You end up with wheels that tend to flex more with lateral forces or crack.

4. Don't trust a manuf. who has to use the name of the process in their name! (iforgeries), can't offer specifics in their process or just makes custom applications to order.

PM me and I'd be more than happy to send you my # or call you and discuss all of this over the phone with you or anyone else on the forum.

Ron
 

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compared to O.Z. i think you'll get less vibration at high speeds.

my 2 pennies!

have fun


If you're getting vibration at highspeed and your wheels are balanced correctly, you've got crappy wheels!

When you take stacked tolerances into account, you can see where the drilling out of wheel blanks to customer needed bolt patterns and offsets could create a problem. Maybe the clamping force wasn't applied uniformly when it went into the drill press, maybe the drill bit skated a little before biting...what you end up with is a wheel who's center bore isn't actually centered in the wheel, therefor you never have a truely balanced wheel.

In the world of high performance automobiles, you don't want to risk you life trusting an inferior product.

How many people here are using a very low volume "custom" tire? Or do you use a mass produced/tested/and proven tire like Michelin or Pirelli? This is because the amount of money that goes into testing, design, materials, development and research is offset by the OE business and the sheer volume of product that they sell. They are able to offer a better product because of this. Wheels are probably more complicated than tires and are put through almost the same stresses and expected to last the lifetime of the car, not just 10-20k miles...
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I thought OZ "had" one of the best reputations for wheels...at least they did over here in europe!

Ok, so if OZ are out and so is HRE, Iforged, and the latest I heard was that BBS had filed for bankruptcy, what reputable manufacturers are left?:confused:
 

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I thought OZ "had" one of the best reputations for wheels...at least they did over here in europe!

Ok, so if OZ are out and so is HRE, Iforged, and the latest I heard was that BBS had filed for bankruptcy, what reputable manufacturers are left?:confused:
BBS did not file for bankruptcy, it was "financial restructuring" and it doesn't affect product or manufactoring. They mix their own alloys from scratch and raw prices of materials has had a huge impact on their not raising prices in a while. in 2 more months it will be business as usual.

Fikse isn't BAD, it's just not the best option. Ok for the street but not your best performer and sometimes less performance than the OE (80% off BBS business is OE).

HRE is borderline dangerous, especially on the track.

OZ is a recent change, I think it was just about 2 years ago now that Tire Rack took a controlling interest. I really can't comment much on their quality, except that most of their product is no longer made to the same standards as it was in Italy.

I know alot on this list have bought iForged but just look at some of the basic problems they've had installing them (wrong offsets sent, etc), does that speak quality? I don't mean to pick on this company specifically, it's just that recently I've seen more problems with them and uneducated consumers buying them than HRE's. Like I said before, talking to a reputable and educated shop locally who can sit down and listen to what you want to accomplish and then advise you on how that can be done is the step most people skip. They tend to read these forums as work, and just like me, anyone can claim to be an expert and post their "expert opinion". This is why I offer to talk to anyone over the phone and if you're in the US somewhere (me in the NE area, other colleagues across the country), I can arrange to meet you at a reputable shop and go over this in person. This past month I've spent every saturday presenting to car clubs about the wheel industry in general: Audi of Virginia, Porsche North Jersey, Porsche SE PA, Audi PA, BMW VA next weekend.


If you're going to replace the wheels on your car, you have to ask yourself

1. Why?
-To increase performance on the street? Hands down, you want a BBS die-forged, let's say that these are 100% of available performance. In the greater than 75% to 90% you have Dymag composites, Speedline, Fikse, OZ (*keep in mind this means they have a product or two, not their entire product line!)

-To increase performance on the track/for competition? You want a BBS motorsports wheel. There's no such thing as an all purpose wheel, just like there's no such thing as an all season high performance tire. It's the typical triangle with lateral strength, weight and impact strength at the three corners. You can't have all three. If the car isn't going to be on the street then you want a motorsports wheel. There's a reason BBS wheels had 100% of the field at 12Hours of Sebring and they're not a spec wheel, which means everyone chose them over the competition. Also, BBS NEVER gives away their product to race teams, everyone purchases everything at full price. Schumaker paid full price for each of his 7.8lb forged magnessium wheels and there's no better marketing than Ferrari as far as race products go. Even working for the company, my race team pays full price for our wheels (no employess discounts). Why can they do this, because they're the best

-To change the overall look of the car?
-If you're considering chrome, it doesn't matter what you put on the car, you shouldn't be driving the Maserati in the first place. I don't think there's a quality chrome wheel out there in the marketplace, the chroming process would destroy a quality wheel so no one respectable does it.

-If you want something larger or a different than OE style, it's a tough call.
-BBS are made for performance, design is dictated by FEM analysis on which is the most efficient and lightweight design, not by shaping the spokes to look cool. It's a "race look" as this is the companies heritage. Mos tof the product line looks very similar.
-A "deep dish" look is going to require a low offset where italian cars typically have a high offset. This means you're wheels are going to sit outside your fenders. They're also going to be very prone to bending the outer lip.
-If you want black centers, a polished lip or something else for the look of the car, you have to realize you're decreasing the performance on your vehicle to get that look and then drive accordingly. You'll have to be extra careful to avoid potholes, hard cornering and forget about highspeed driving.

Again, if anyone wants more detail or particulars that I can't post on a public forum, please feel free to PM me your number and I'd be more than happy to explain over the phone or in person. I'm in Boston, Philly, NY, DC, Hartford areas all about once a month presenting at shops.
 

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I have an 05 Coupe CC Vintage with ball polished rims. The stem caps say BBS on the top so I assumed they were BBS wheels. They are awesome and I'd never change them out. Chrome would look flashier but ball polished are almost there.

Interesting thread for shizzle! You guys are so smart! ;)
 

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I have an 05 Coupe CC Vintage with ball polished rims. The stem caps say BBS on the top so I assumed they were BBS wheels. They are awesome and I'd never change them out. Chrome would look flashier but ball polished are almost there.

Interesting thread for shizzle! You guys are so smart! ;)
Like I said, 80% of BBS's business is OE jobs. They make all the wheels for Maserati right now and most of the Ferrari wheels. Also BMW, MB, Audi, Jag, Bentley, AMG, TRD, Alpina...the actual list is huge.

The ball polishing is a process like sand blasting only the media is about the size of bb's and it low pressure. The wheel sits in a vat while the whole thing is vibrated and the media rolls across the wheels for a while.

BBS has a great video on manuf. processes and technology (when you see the flow forming process and machine you'll understand why the wheels cost as much as they do): http://www.bbs-usa.com/index.php?id=678

Technical Info: http://www.bbs-usa.com/index.php?id=318
Die-Forging (best aftermarket option): http://www.bbs-usa.com/index.php?id=331
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Mille, you certainly know your wheels! However, you dont work for BBS do you?;) LOL

Im not fussed about drving my car on the track as I have an M3 for that but I do drive the Maser quite hard on the road so the last thing I want is a bent rim. My main reason for the change for me is that the standard spoked wheels dont do the car justice, particularly the fronts which kind of have a reverse dish...and they're a size too small.

Gransport wheels look better but they've still got that sticky out look. Personal preference, I know.:rolleyes:

Ive done some digging and found out that Tire Rack only holds a controlling interest for OZ in the US only.

Fortunately for us in europe all our wheels are made in Italy as before.

Just to redress the balance slightly away from BBS (who do make brilliant wheels without doubt), OZ wheels are in fact fitted as OE equipment to the Bugatti Veyron, Maclaren SLR and F1 so you cant really get a much better endorcement of quality than that really.
 

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Ive done some digging and found out that Tire Rack only holds a controlling interest for OZ in the US only.

Fortunately for us in europe all our wheels are made in Italy as before.
Sorry, I don't have all the information on OZ, I just know the TireRack purchase is a controlling interest and here in the US, most wheels are no longer made in Italy. I know they're doing some stuff for open wheel cars and other motorsport applications, no one has been able to figure out what's going on with the motorcycle support (used to make OE wheels for Aprilia, and even Aprilia dealers aren't aware if they're still making or just NOS).

The sure way to tell would be to flip the wheel you're looking at buying over and check out the stampings on the back, if they're made in Italy it'll be stamped there

As far as the look goes for a deeper dish look, that's a hard one to overcome. The Maserati has a very high offset so most wheels you put on are going to have the spokes close to the edge of the rim, this is because of where the wheel sits in the wheel well. It's hard to change that geometry and the most you'll be able to squeeze is an inch or two (a few cm's for those overseas) until you start to have fitment problems with hitting your suspension or sticking out past your fenders.

Let us know what you decide and be sure to post some pics when you get them installed!
 

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How about the quality of MOMO wheels? I like some of its design but cannot find one to fit my coupe.
Momo had a reputation for making good wheels, I'm not sure where the company stands lately, they've been having alot of inventory and production problems, alot of the Momo distributors I deal with have stopped carrying the product because of this. Now, this is mostly their steering wheels and shift knobs, which is what they've been mostly known for. As far as their wheels go, I can't comment on the quality or durability.

If you're the type of guy who would buy an exhaust system based on a dyno sheet showing it makes the most power than you should be asking "what's the best wheel for my car for street driving, DE track days or full track use". If you would buy an exhaust system because it sounds really good or you like the way the tips look, you'll probably be more concerned with the cosmetic aspects of your wheels than their performance and you have a different set of qualifications for what you buy.
 
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