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Discussion Starter #1
after a week of vacation, here i am, trying to take my car for a drive but as soon as as turn my key, some weird unusual beeps are coming from the car and the Gear # display blink, with the Gearbox error icon displayed.
My battery seems fine as everything else seems to work but if i want to switch on the engine ... nothing.
If i press the brake pedal firmly, the beep stops and i'm able to change gear using the paddles.Then if i'm trying to start the engine, i have a strange repeated noise, as if the car was protecting itself from starting the engine.
Any help or am i doomed today ?
 

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:confused: Based upon similar experience with my former 03 Spyder CC, sounds like could be F1 pump failure.:
 

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after a week of vacation, here i am, trying to take my car for a drive but as soon as as turn my key, some weird unusual beeps are coming from the car and the Gear # display blink, with the Gearbox error icon displayed.
My battery seems fine as everything else seems to work but if i want to switch on the engine ... nothing.
If i press the brake pedal firmly, the beep stops and i'm able to change gear using the paddles.Then if i'm trying to start the engine, i have a strange repeated noise, as if the car was protecting itself from starting the engine.
Any help or am i doomed today ?
Tend to agree with the above comment. You left your car at home before dashing out, but, despite turning off the ignition, the F1 pump relay might have failed at some stage... thus making the pump work continuously... leading to failure (the pump frying).

A quick test to check if it is indeed the pump is simple : get near the car, press the key to disengage the alarm (as when preparing to get into the car) and check if you hear the pump loading (a whine as soon as you press the fob). If you hear nothing, then it is potentially bad news.

Try next to cut the power from the mains (black) switch in the boot, by the battery bay. Wait for 1/2 an hour (do not close the boot) and then turn on again. Cycle through the arming-disarming of the alarm; again, if no noise from the pump loading, guess it's gone.

Best check would be to hook an OBD reader to retrieve the error code, if any stored (which guess should be, as you've seen the gearbox error icon).

HTH
 

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When mine failed was covered by warranty. Posts on this site seem to put cost for replacement at b/w $2,500 and $3,500. You will want to ask about replacement of the clutch and the relay at the same time.

Of course, you could end up doing what I did, trade for newer model year.

Good luck.
 

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ah thanks, i'll try the above, just fmi, is a new pump expensive ?
check with a mechanic, some times it is just the relay that burns out. this happens because it overheats and then i just cooks.

if it is just that then you are looking a a cheep part, if the pump fail then they need to replace the relay and put a new pump + change the hydro. fluid

this is very common for our cars. i personally feel that there is really no reason to take it to a FM dealer. any good mechanic can fix this.

our cars are very very simple. no special tools or crazy bold like bmw or MB. (the key work is "metric"):D

if you want to feel more comfortable and don't really care about the extra cost then just take it to the dealer . the other solution is going to the dealer for the parts, and taking it to ether a good Italian mechanic or a guy you trust.

i have a great relationship with the part guy at my dealer and he always helps me out and tells me how to do the maintenance so i can tell my mechanic.

hope it's not to bad and good luck...

-willie
 

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I can certainly relate to your problem.
A few weeks ago, I decided to trade my 2002 Spyder Cambio for 2002 Coupe (Cambio) at Lamborghini Dallas.
They sent their shipping company (817 Luxury Auto Transport out of Fort Worth) to pick my car up in Scottsdale, AZ.
I use my car as daily transportation and am therefore always charging the battery. As well, I had the car serviced and inspected not that long ago, including the F1 pump and transmission which was working very well.
Long story short, when my Spyder arrived at the dealership in Dallas, the battery was dead, the relay was fried, and the F1 pump was shot.
Although they deny it, I know that the shipper either did not turn the car off properly, left the key in the ignition, or something...because it's too much of a coincedence...especially since the trip took them only 12 hours direct.
Anyhow, I wound up paying for their screw-up which cost me $1,850.
 

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check with a mechanic, some times it is just the relay that burns out. this happens because it overheats and then i just cooks.

if it is just that then you are looking a a cheep part, if the pump fail then they need to replace the relay and put a new pump + change the hydro. fluid

this is very common for our cars. i personally feel that there is really no reason to take it to a FM dealer. any good mechanic can fix this.
Thing is, Willie, that if the relay fries the pump gets stuck, and after some hours it cooks. But worth checking very bit before going for the pump itself, which is an expensive replacement.

That's why I replace the relay on every yearly service... the "if it ain't broke, why fix it?" lemma does not quite apply here, as these relays will fail by use after some time. The great thing would be to use solid-state ones as replacement. There is nothing other than the relay which would make the pump go so quickly, as it seems is the case with our cars.

For your reference, here are some photos of the offending spare

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c143/edsalazar/Maser/DSC00418.jpg

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c143/edsalazar/Maser/DSC00417.jpg

Stamped Tyco part # is V23134-B57-X203, but it is not listed as such in the OEM Tyco catalog, so I guess this spare is made for Fiat/Maserati (they should have the equivalent part, better check with a specialist.)

HTH
 

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thanks man,

i am going to start to replace it every year now. stupid little part :)

i wonder if Ferrari's have the same problem?

-willie
 

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thanks man,

i am going to start to replace it every year now. stupid little part :)
... and cheap (what, 30/40 bucks..?) and an easy, 30 min labor job. That potentially saves you big dosh into changing the whole thing. Not that it will fool-proof against pump failure, but it will give the system much more life. Again, even a new relay can fail prematurely, but relays do fail after certain time.

Same as with gear shift ratio calibration. My Coupe was behaving a bit edgy (shifts were not smooth, esp. between 3rd and 4th and on downshifting it was choking a bit too much for comfort) and happened to be at a dealer to pick-up a spare. Checked with them and they said "...oooh, we need to bring down the tranny to inspect the clutch..." or some BS like that, and they suggested the bill could be hefty.

Spoke to my mechanic (specialised Maser/Ferrarri independent; he can work blind-folded on a 4200 and a 3200) commenting the dealer's reaction, laughted and said "bring it in, it's a simple thing." Went on Saturday. They have a special proggie (loaded using the SD hardware via ODB) which recalibrates the gearbox ratios. Half an hour job. The software crawls all gears upwards and downwards, and it happened there were some gaps in between gears, that's why it was not shifting smoothly (the self-learning procedure sometimes de-tunes, and nothing you can do brings it back to normal). After re-tuning, I must say the car drives like a dream. Cost? equivalent of 40 bucks... (I'm in the UK)

He suggests to do a check every 6/8 months, to max clutch life, as driving habits do change (alternating highway/city) which degrades the camboicorsa sequencing over time. No fudging with "hard reboots" will sort it out completely.

... and on the dealer's recommended course of action, well, the clutch is in good shape.

Which means: sometimes, you can correct/adjust things in our cars for much, much less than a dealer will let you think about. There is so much hype about things being costly on these cars; arguably some are (very) but you can avoid them by corrective action, which costs nothing in comparison and keeps the car running at its prime.

The only (major) thing is to be lucky to find a good/honest mechanic.

Just my 2 c.
 

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When did you start replacing the relay switch?

... and cheap (what, 30/40 bucks..?) and an easy, 30 min labor job. That potentially saves you big dosh into changing the whole thing. Not that it will fool-proof against pump failure, but it will give the system much more life. Again, even a new relay can fail prematurely, but relays do fail after certain time.

Same as with gear shift ratio calibration. My Coupe was behaving a bit edgy (shifts were not smooth, esp. between 3rd and 4th and on downshifting it was choking a bit too much for comfort) and happened to be at a dealer to pick-up a spare. Checked with them and they said "...oooh, we need to bring down the tranny to inspect the clutch..." or some BS like that, and they suggested the bill could be hefty.

Spoke to my mechanic (specialised Maser/Ferrarri independent; he can work blind-folded on a 4200 and a 3200) commenting the dealer's reaction, laughted and said "bring it in, it's a simple thing." Went on Saturday. They have a special proggie (loaded using the SD hardware via ODB) which recalibrates the gearbox ratios. Half an hour job. The software crawls all gears upwards and downwards, and it happened there were some gaps in between gears, that's why it was not shifting smoothly (the self-learning procedure sometimes de-tunes, and nothing you can do brings it back to normal). After re-tuning, I must say the car drives like a dream. Cost? equivalent of 40 bucks... (I'm in the UK)

He suggests to do a check every 6/8 months, to max clutch life, as driving habits do change (alternating highway/city) which degrades the camboicorsa sequencing over time. No fudging with "hard reboots" will sort it out completely.

... and on the dealer's recommended course of action, well, the clutch is in good shape.

Which means: sometimes, you can correct/adjust things in our cars for much, much less than a dealer will let you think about. There is so much hype about things being costly on these cars; arguably some are (very) but you can avoid them by corrective action, which costs nothing in comparison and keeps the car running at its prime.

The only (major) thing is to be lucky to find a good/honest mechanic.

Just my 2 c.
Troesma:

I completely agree with your preventitive maintenace.

When did you start replacing the relay switch? How many miles and or time between replacements? Has your F1 pump ever died? What are the signs of a dying F1 pump?

Do you do it yourself?

Can you post the steps and or some pictures?

Does the dealer sell the best replacement part or does someone else make a more reliable part?

Any idea when, how or what causes these switches to burn out?

I have an 04 with 15,000 miles on it.

Thanks for your help and sorry for all the questions...

CM
 

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Same Problem....That Damn F1 Pump!!

I had the exact same experience a few months ago in my 04' Coupe CC - same symptoms, called the local Maserati dealer in Dubai (Middle East) & told me that it was the most commom problem on Maseratis...Anyway, forked out US$ 2K for a new F1 Pump (after waiting a week to get the part ordered & delivered from Italy), drnally got it fixed & drove the car out & within two blocks that same thing happened again !! Called the dealer & told me that they ordered the wrong pump by mistake!!! Never-the-less got the car towed to the dealer, waited another week for a replacement part, drove it for half a day & the same thing happened again !! After the forth time, the car runs smootly (fingures crossed). So ever far away in Arabia....Maserati drivers are suffering from the same thing.
 

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Troesma:

I completely agree with your preventitive maintenace.

When did you start replacing the relay switch? How many miles and or time between replacements? Has your F1 pump ever died? What are the signs of a dying F1 pump?
Replaced after my first clutch went early. Do it on every yearly service (mine is a 03 so only did it twice so far). F1 pump NEVER died (touch wood) and on 28000 miles already. Signs of pump dying : lots of trouble engaging gears (move up from 1st, downshifting, etc.) but when it goes, it goes very quick.

Do you do it yourself?
Nope, my mechanic does. 30 min job. In fact, he recommends doing it to every customer on their yearly service.

Can you post the steps and or some pictures?
As I never done it myself...

Does the dealer sell the best replacement part or does someone else make a more reliable part?
As said above, I tried to search this specific part # in Tyco official catalogue, but it's not there (only the generic code V23134 is listed, with sub-cats but none indicating this specific part for the Maser). Would order it from any dealer; it's a cheap spare anyway.

Any idea when, how or what causes these switches to burn out?
Relays do fail, at one point or another. On the Maser, I think it could be due to poor electrical design (leading, e.g., to voltage drops or spikes) which is not surprising for an Italian car.

I have an 04 with 15,000 miles on it.
Are you on your first clutch?

Thanks for your help and sorry for all the questions...
CM
No probs :)
 

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Thanks...

Thanks for the info.

I am still on my first clutch... I drive 60 / 40 highway and city always in sports mode. No hills, very little reverse. Car currently shifts and handles very smooth.

I was told, its time to replace your clutch when it begins to slip, from a tech at the dealer. The wear software is not 100% accurate. He has changed clutches as low as 12,000 miles and as high as 35,000 miles.

At my 18,000 mile service I am planning on doing all the fluids, filters, brake pads and now the F1 Pump relay.

It would be nice to hear a service guy at the dealership recommend this type of preventitive maintenance. I would have no problem paying the dealer for this Maserati Specific item.

CM
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Just a quick update on my car. It's been fixed for $2,700 :(
It was due to the memory seat that didnt switch off, killing the battery. They had to change that module + a new battery.
I feel better driving it again, i was already fed up with my wife's car :p
 

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Just a quick update on my car. It's been fixed for $2,700 :(
It was due to the memory seat that didnt switch off, killing the battery. They had to change that module + a new battery.
I feel better driving it again, i was already fed up with my wife's car :p
You've got to be kidding...

The seat memory module + a new battery (what was fitted? A crappy FIAMM or something better; e.g. Interstate or Optima?) plus labor, for 2.7K..?

The module is 415 Pounds here in the UK, which I reckon would be 415 US there, but say 650 US. Or even say 830 US assuming same price holds (and a 2:1 exchange rate.) That plus a battery. Plus installation. 2.7K? Sorry to say, looks you've been ripped off :mad:
 

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Sorry to say, looks you've been ripped off :mad:
I agree with Troesma,

This cost probably includes the Seat memory module, which is unnecessary to be replaced. A short is more likely to develop at the wire harness connectors, the dealer should have just replace the faulty wire harness first.

I had a intermittent memory seat fault a while back, the dealer swapped out the memory module three time (under warranty) and problem did not go away. At the end, the fault was track down to the seat tracks. But it looks like the official procedure is to replace everything and hope for the best. The techs do not want to spend time to properly diagnose your faults.

I hope you got the memory module back, which you can ask it to be diagnoses by NMA.
 

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Just a quick update on my car. It's been fixed for $2,700 :(
It was due to the memory seat that didnt switch off, killing the battery. They had to change that module + a new battery.
I feel better driving it again, i was already fed up with my wife's car :p
did it include a hot girl for the day?

or maybe a butler for the week?

or at lest a Maserati baseball cap?

i REALY hate to agree with the rest, but if you did not get a HAPPY ending;) you need to get your money back my friend...
 

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This cost probably includes the Seat memory module, which is unnecessary to be replaced. A short is more likely to develop at the wire harness connectors, the dealer should have just replace the faulty wire harness first.
Very true, but even if they replaced the module it costs, what, about 800 bucks at most? And I mean AT MOST (with a gun on your head). It doesn't even add-up to 2.7K in that scenario (ahh... forgot the battery...)

willie said:
or at lest a Maserati baseball cap?
Have not thought about that one :D

If it is a Maser official dealer, I would raise the issue immediately with MNA. If you sorted this at an independent, guess you've been done.

Very unfortunate either case.
 

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In the dealers defence, how many hours were spent (at $125 per hour) tracking down the short?
I'm sure that finding the source of the short took a fair amount of time.
 
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