Performance Mods?! - Page 4 - Maserati Forum
 
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post #46 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 01:54 AM
 
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Originally Posted by psb1013 View Post
That's probably why.....you had the old school, herky-jerky F1 and I have the ZF auto where the effect is likely more dramatic. You also might have had your DBW set to the less-aggressive mode.

Lol. Have you driven the F1 before? It certainly doesn't jerk when driven in manual sport mode.


My DBW was set to most aggressive, and a middle setting (it comes with 2 selectable settings as you know).
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post #47 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 02:11 AM

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Originally Posted by jlobo941 View Post
How about the girl's pink slip?
Now we’re talking...

I must find some local 09 Maserati with the F1, and also another with the DBW mod just to get a sense for the difference vs. my plain GTS .

The Ferrari Pista’s F1 ( which I drove last week ) was as smooth as silk, but of course in a decade the technology has advanced by leaps, and maybe for the $ 350,000 price tag the transmission might have also been tuned by Swiss watchmakers . No jerky motions with that F1
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post #48 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 02:22 AM
 
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You honestly can't compare a F1 car to a DCT...It was an evolution of technology.. I want to say 355 Ferrari was first car with robotized gearbox..I could be wrong? Jason

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post #49 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 03:00 AM
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Originally Posted by 18000rpm View Post
You're falling for marketing talk. The DBW does not improve acceleration. I had it on my car for about 3 years (F1 gearbox).

I'm pretty sure FD make no claims at all about improved acceleration:

Provides a Dramatic Improvement in Throttle Response and Power Delivery across the entire RPM Range

Not quite the same thing. The Internet, OTOH....

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post #50 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 03:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Catmanv2 View Post
I'm pretty sure FD make no claims at all about improved acceleration:

Provides a Dramatic Improvement in Throttle Response and Power Delivery across the entire RPM Range

Exactly, but psb1013 claims the DBW actually makes the car faster which is not true.


Quote:
Originally Posted by psb1013
Performance improvements are real. Reflexes are sharper and the car gets to speed much quicker. Before, I had issues just merging onto a highway because the car took forever getting up speed. Now, after DBW, getting up to speed quickly is a piece of cake.

Assuming you're at full throttle, can you explain just HOW the DBW module is able to 'get to speed much quicker' than stock?
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post #51 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 04:01 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 18000rpm View Post
Lol. Have you driven the F1 before? It certainly doesn't jerk when driven in manual sport mode.


My DBW was set to most aggressive, and a middle setting (it comes with 2 selectable settings as you know).

My F430 spider and 599 GTB has F1's. It's alright during manual shifting but jerky as hell in auto mode, and thus, I never use it. I've never driven a GT with a F1 but heard the mechanism is similar to the 599's. The 599's F1 is a bit quicker than the 430's but let's not kid ourselves, it's still no DCT (or a good ZF even) in terms of speed and smoothness (and reliability).

2013 Maserati GT MC Convertible: Bianco Eldorado/Nero; Carbon Aero PK; Int. Carbon-Evo I+II; 20% tint; clear bra; Larini sport cats; DBW
2008 Ferrari F430 Spider: Avus Bianco ext/Red leather int; Daytona seats; Carbon dash trim and steering wheel; 20% tint; clear bra; Sport exhaust (LOUD!)
2008 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano: Nero/Cuoio; F1 superfast trans; Daytona seats
2010 Lambo Gallardo Spider LP560-4: Nero Noctis/Nero
2019 Ferrari Portofino: Rosso Corsa/Nero

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post #52 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 04:03 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Catmanv2 View Post
I'm pretty sure FD make no claims at all about improved acceleration....
Grancabrio Drive By Wire Enhancement Module for Maserati GranCabrio

Actually, If you look in the upper right section, it says "Noticeably Improves Acceleration/Take Off"

Gotcha there, Catman!

2013 Maserati GT MC Convertible: Bianco Eldorado/Nero; Carbon Aero PK; Int. Carbon-Evo I+II; 20% tint; clear bra; Larini sport cats; DBW
2008 Ferrari F430 Spider: Avus Bianco ext/Red leather int; Daytona seats; Carbon dash trim and steering wheel; 20% tint; clear bra; Sport exhaust (LOUD!)
2008 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano: Nero/Cuoio; F1 superfast trans; Daytona seats
2010 Lambo Gallardo Spider LP560-4: Nero Noctis/Nero
2019 Ferrari Portofino: Rosso Corsa/Nero

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post #53 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 04:09 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 18000rpm View Post
Exactly, but psb1013 claims the DBW actually makes the car faster which is not true.
I've never said faster (if what you mean is top-end speed), but better acceleration and throttle response. (And I also have the sport cats which also contributes to the improvement).

It'll be nice if FD can chime in and give their response. ……..oddly, their silence is deafening

In any case, I really don't care if you don't believe in any of this. That's your experience.

Bottom line for me is that I got some very good results from these mods and I'm very happy about it. (And it's not just me, online reviews have been overwhelmingly positive).

End of story.

2013 Maserati GT MC Convertible: Bianco Eldorado/Nero; Carbon Aero PK; Int. Carbon-Evo I+II; 20% tint; clear bra; Larini sport cats; DBW
2008 Ferrari F430 Spider: Avus Bianco ext/Red leather int; Daytona seats; Carbon dash trim and steering wheel; 20% tint; clear bra; Sport exhaust (LOUD!)
2008 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano: Nero/Cuoio; F1 superfast trans; Daytona seats
2010 Lambo Gallardo Spider LP560-4: Nero Noctis/Nero
2019 Ferrari Portofino: Rosso Corsa/Nero

Last edited by psb1013; 05-15-2019 at 04:34 AM.
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post #54 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 04:39 AM
 
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Originally Posted by psb1013 View Post
My F430 spider and 599 GTB has F1's. It's alright during manual shifting but jerky as hell in auto mode, and thus, I never use it. I've never driven a GT with a F1 but heard the mechanism is similar to the 599's. The 599's F1 is a bit quicker than the 430's but let's not kid ourselves, it's still no DCT in terms of speed and smoothness (and reliability).

The GT's F1 gearbox is exactly the same as that in the 599 GTB, called F1 Superfast, 100ms shift times.


Quote:
If you look in the upper right section, it says "Noticeably Improves Acceleration/Take Off"
That is vague. It certainly improves acceleration and take off at half throttle pedal input, for example. And people don't usually take off at full throttle in regular driving, so by remapping the throttle input it certainly makes the car feel 'noticeably' faster.



Quote:
It'll be nice if FD can jump into this thread and give their response. ……..oddly, their silence is deafening
FD is usually ready to chime in on every thread they're mentioned (especially a thread with the title 'Performance Mods') but you won't hear them come in here and say the DBW makes the car faster or provides better acceleration at wide-open throttle. It doesn't. I GUARANTEE you FD will not claim a specific time improvement in 0-60 or quarter mile time publicly with the DBW alone.



I'm not here to bad mouth FD. I've bought quite a few items from them for my car (quiet brake pads, which solved my brake squeal problem), sport springs (which works as advertised) and the DBW (which, despite all the positive feedback here, I personally found disappointing as to me it wasn't any better than just being more aggressive with the throttle and shifts). It does improve perceptive performance, and 'solves' the problem of the somewhat passive throttle mapping of the stock Granturismo which makes some people feel the car is slow or 'sluggish' off the line.
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post #55 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 04:52 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 18000rpm View Post
….. It does improve perceptive performance, and 'solves' the problem of the somewhat passive throttle mapping of the stock Granturismo which makes some people feel the car is slow or 'sluggish' off the line.
Well, given the huge mass and weight of this car, anything helps. And there is only so much you can do with a NA engine, apart from a tune, which rarely gives you much ROI.

For me DBW and sport cats made a big difference in overall performance and turned my GT from a large, sluggish cruiser to a large, athletic cruiser. I'm happy.

2013 Maserati GT MC Convertible: Bianco Eldorado/Nero; Carbon Aero PK; Int. Carbon-Evo I+II; 20% tint; clear bra; Larini sport cats; DBW
2008 Ferrari F430 Spider: Avus Bianco ext/Red leather int; Daytona seats; Carbon dash trim and steering wheel; 20% tint; clear bra; Sport exhaust (LOUD!)
2008 Ferrari 599 GTB Fiorano: Nero/Cuoio; F1 superfast trans; Daytona seats
2010 Lambo Gallardo Spider LP560-4: Nero Noctis/Nero
2019 Ferrari Portofino: Rosso Corsa/Nero
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post #56 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 01:27 PM Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by psb1013 View Post
I think you'll be very pleasantly surprised. The car absolutely flies from a standing start when you hit the gas. It's no joke. Normal mode feels like sport mode, and sport mode feels like an absent "race" mode. The car feels so much more aggressive compared to stock. But don't just take my word for it, the vast majority of online reviews are overwhelmingly positive.
I'll take your word for it! I know you a long time here and for you to say something really positive about the Masi, it surely must be!


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post #57 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 03:13 PM

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Originally Posted by 18000rpm View Post
The GT's F1 gearbox is exactly the same as that in the 599 GTB, called F1 Superfast, 100ms shift times.


That is vague. It certainly improves acceleration and take off at half throttle pedal input, for example. And people don't usually take off at full throttle in regular driving, so by remapping the throttle input it certainly makes the car feel 'noticeably' faster.



FD is usually ready to chime in on every thread they're mentioned (especially a thread with the title 'Performance Mods') but you won't hear them come in here and say the DBW makes the car faster or provides better acceleration at wide-open throttle. It doesn't. I GUARANTEE you FD will not claim a specific time improvement in 0-60 or quarter mile time publicly with the DBW alone.



I'm not here to bad mouth FD. I've bought quite a few items from them for my car (quiet brake pads, which solved my brake squeal problem), sport springs (which works as advertised) and the DBW (which, despite all the positive feedback here, I personally found disappointing as to me it wasn't any better than just being more aggressive with the throttle and shifts). It does improve perceptive performance, and 'solves' the problem of the somewhat passive throttle mapping of the stock Granturismo which makes some people feel the car is slow or 'sluggish' off the line.
The GT and QP F1 setups are more similar to the 599 and 612 than the 430, but I would not call it the superfast. The Superfast has improved syncros in the gearbox itself and I'm unsure if they ever made that upgrade on the Maserati side. I, personally, never understood the need as the legacy F1 syncros were butter smooth.

As for the "jerkyness," welcome to the wonderful world of conventional clutches. It'll never be a smooth as a DCT, but there's NO WAY a DCT will tolerate the abuse that a F1 can withstand. Ever. The DCTs fail left and right down here in Florida, where there's lots of young F drivers. My friend has a 488 in his shop right now with burned clutches. Of course, with 300 launches, he's already exceeded the factory spec. My F1 on the other hand has been run harder than any other sedan in the country I suspect, and it's still shifts hard and on a dime. Did I mention it's got 116K miles on it now? If I burn it out, then I'll throw in another clutch. No big deal.

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post #58 of 93 Old 05-15-2019, 07:09 PM
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Wow, this thread really got going We do our best to check the forums but we're not on here all the time, checking every post. We just try to help when we can. Sometimes we're more active than others depending on how busy we are.

18000rpm, we don't always know who is who on the forum but honestly, you may have had a problem with your installer. We hate to say that especially if it it turns out to not be true but if it was who we think it may have been we did have a few complaints and when we looked into an install with at least one customer in detail, we did find issues that would affect performance of the kit. With that said, we're not wanting to call that installer out publicly or anything, mistakes happen, one day you have a good tech at the shop, a few months later, maybe the same talent is no longer with the shop and you get a different install tech just trying to do his best. It's a challenge we see that faces many shops, even the best ones. So we simply no longer recommend them and we'll just leave it at that.

All this really means is that we're honestly not sure that you got the same results as you should have on your GT-S. With that said, would that additional difference have helped enough for you to report different, it's really hard to say. Some people appreciate that difference more than others. Of course, it's still possible that yours was installed well but we seem to remember questioning the install at the time we discussed and never really got to the bottom of it but later found an error with the same installer that revealed a problem that was correctable (again, if we aren't mixing up customers here)

It's true that we don't quote any hard fast improvement times, most people with the upgrade agree that it makes a real improvement on the car and are very happy with it. Some owners install them on cars with an already low performing F1 system that has problems while another may install the kit on a well setup and maintained F1 car, honestly their results will vary a bit just for that reason alone.

Sport Cats, ECU Tune make a nice improvement but if you're talking about a big power adder, which we think of as 75+ horsepower, the only way forward is forced induction or perhaps NOS as JLobo has done. For the new Turbo cars, we can obviously do a bit more but there are limits as to what can be done on a Normally Aspirated car.

Hope that helps but we think the main point is that good improvements can be made to these cars not just in power but in response, handling braking, etc... but you want to have the right expectation that it's not going to completely change the car into a GT3 slaying monster or anything. These upgrades will enhance what you have and help you get more enjoyment from it.

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post #59 of 93 Old 05-16-2019, 02:43 AM
 
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My experience with the DBW was it did do what was expected (snappier throttle response) but it did not actually make the car faster. Given how it works, assuming you're giving the car full throttle I don't see how it could possibly improve acceleration times (the time it takes to stomp on the gas pedal and reach WOT is pretty negligible even for a stock car).


Regardless, the OP was looking for mods that could improve 0-60 or quartermile times by at least 1 second and I think most here can agree that short of some kind of forced induction setup is unlikely to be achieved on the Granturismo (within reasonable costs). Keep in mind when Maserati increased the car by 20hp in 2012 (434hp vs 454hp) the official 0-60 time improved by 0.2 seconds (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masera...mo#Performance).
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post #60 of 93 Old 05-16-2019, 02:51 AM
 
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+1...The DBW doesn't increase HP or make the car faster...That being said I have never had a customer regret buying one...Jason

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