Clutch life - Maserati Forum
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post #1 of 27 Old 06-15-2019, 02:13 PM Thread Starter
 
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Clutch life

New 2006 GS owner. How will I know when clutch is failing before it fails and leaves me stranded?
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post #2 of 27 Old 06-15-2019, 02:43 PM
 
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It will start to just slide into the next gear without being a real positive change...Higher gears will be first to go...It may also start to stink if you drive it hard for a few minutes...I don't pay much attention to the computer generated clutch wear #...They normally last about 30K or so, but it can vary...Stop and go traffic and dicking around back and forth in a parking lot won't help your cause.....Jason

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post #3 of 27 Old 06-19-2019, 06:12 AM
 
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Originally Posted by [email protected] Enzo`s Atlanta View Post
It will start to just slide into the next gear without being a real positive change...Higher gears will be first to go...It may also start to stink if you drive it hard for a few minutes...I don't pay much attention to the computer generated clutch wear #...They normally last about 30K or so, but it can vary...Stop and go traffic and dicking around back and forth in a parking lot won't help your cause.....Jason
Why do you not pay attention to the clutch wear # ? Everything else Iíve read says it is a good indicator.
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post #4 of 27 Old 06-19-2019, 10:07 AM
 
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I'll give you my latest example...Did a pre-purchase on a coupe and clutch wear read 55% at 25K...Car was back in at 28K the other day and the clutch was starting to slip..Now I didn't get a reading on it and it may have a pressure plate starting to fail, but I'm just not a fan of the clutch wear reading as I have seen it just not be that accurate...Jason

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post #5 of 27 Old 06-19-2019, 01:08 PM

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I 100% agree with Jason on this one.

Too many parameters/factors contribute to that percentage number and for that reason it is only meant to be a guide, primarily when the clutch is new.

For example, if a seller mentions the clutch is new, then you should expect the wear to be under 10%. But once there's at least 10K miles on it, you'd need to assume the NCCP was set properly, the wear index stays at a reasonable number, there's no glazing, overheating, etc., etc., otherwise the wear ratio goes right out the window. In addition, the clutch friction material thickness varies a bit right out of the box, which further throws off those numbers. The NCR does a great job at calculating wear issues and spits that information back to the driver in the form of the 4-digit wear index on the scan tool. That number typically changes, however most people don't pay any attention to it. This is why many new owners are surprised when they see that they only ate up 5% wear in the first 10K miles but it now shows 50% at 20.

On top of all that, as soon as you figure things out, and you're convinced that you've got a solid 30K miles to go until your next clutch replacement, the damn release bearing will start leaking or your F1 sensor will fail, requiring you to tear it all down and start over any way!

In summary - quit worrying and enjoy!

Erik Di Somma
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post #6 of 27 Old 06-20-2019, 01:40 AM
 
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Yeah same experience here. The bearing was slipping on mine. I could hear the squeal during Clutch engagements from first to second. Clutch wear showed 60% left but the Labour to get at the bearing was so much they said may as well replace the clutch. I’ve had the car 9 years and replaced the clutch and assembly once. If you hear a painful squeal or slippage you know your going to have get in there soon.

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post #7 of 27 Old 06-20-2019, 05:57 AM

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Honestly when my clutch went on my QP, about 200 miles after I bought the car, the only symptom was a "yowling" sound when the clutch would engage from a stop sometimes. The gear shifts and everything were perfect, no slippage at all. I was just starting to wonder about the odd yowling sound and then bam, "transmission failure" and the car would not run. This was intermittent, however, so I did manage to drive the car 150 miles to a shop to get the clutch work done.

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post #8 of 27 Old 06-20-2019, 01:41 PM

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Originally Posted by whupwhup View Post
Yeah same experience here. The bearing was slipping on mine. I could hear the squeal during Clutch engagements from first to second. Clutch wear showed 60% left but the Labour to get at the bearing was so much they said may as well replace the clutch. I’ve had the car 9 years and replaced the clutch and assembly once. If you hear a painful squeal or slippage you know your going to have get in there soon.
That sounds like the bell housing bearing. There is a service bulletin on the QP indicating that the bearing that separates the bell housing from the shaft starts to spin in its seat during takeoff. Typically it happens either from a stop or from first to second gear. It makes a squealing noise. The fix is to R&R the bearing and re-seat it with a scoring tool and loctite. You're right however, it's a beeotch to remove and once you drop the bell housing the rest is just staring you in the face, so you're better off replacing all of it.

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post #9 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 03:54 AM
 
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Originally Posted by [email protected] Enzo`s Atlanta View Post
I'll give you my latest example...Did a pre-purchase on a coupe and clutch wear read 55% at 25K...Car was back in at 28K the other day and the clutch was starting to slip..Now I didn't get a reading on it and it may have a pressure plate starting to fail, but I'm just not a fan of the clutch wear reading as I have seen it just not be that accurate...Jason
Quote:
Originally Posted by ErikDiSomma View Post
I 100% agree with Jason on this one.

Too many parameters/factors contribute to that percentage number and for that reason it is only meant to be a guide, primarily when the clutch is new.

For example, if a seller mentions the clutch is new, then you should expect the wear to be under 10%. But once there's at least 10K miles on it, you'd need to assume the NCCP was set properly, the wear index stays at a reasonable number, there's no glazing, overheating, etc., etc., otherwise the wear ratio goes right out the window. In addition, the clutch friction material thickness varies a bit right out of the box, which further throws off those numbers. The NCR does a great job at calculating wear issues and spits that information back to the driver in the form of the 4-digit wear index on the scan tool. That number typically changes, however most people don't pay any attention to it. This is why many new owners are surprised when they see that they only ate up 5% wear in the first 10K miles but it now shows 50% at 20.

On top of all that, as soon as you figure things out, and you're convinced that you've got a solid 30K miles to go until your next clutch replacement, the damn release bearing will start leaking or your F1 sensor will fail, requiring you to tear it all down and start over any way!

In summary - quit worrying and enjoy!
Quote:
Originally Posted by whupwhup View Post
Yeah same experience here. The bearing was slipping on mine. I could hear the squeal during Clutch engagements from first to second. Clutch wear showed 60% left but the Labour to get at the bearing was so much they said may as well replace the clutch. Iíve had the car 9 years and replaced the clutch and assembly once. If you hear a painful squeal or slippage you know your going to have get in there soon.
Thatís all very helpful. Thanks. I donít recognize the acronyms NCCP and NCR, but I presume at least one of those is the diagnostic computer that techs use. I have a copy of the readout from a scan done at the dealer. It
shows a bunch of measurements, but with no reference for what is ďgoodĒ. Therefore, I donít know if any are key performance parameters I should be looking at as possible predictors of impending doom? clutch pressure plate travel, engagement potentiometer travel, selection potentiometer travel, closed clutch position, clutch touch point, clutch wear degree, neutral engagement counter, etc.... I expect some of those go into the calculation of overall clutch wear but donít know which are the ones that drive the calculation.

Reason I ask is that Iím flying in to pick up the car and then driving it ~850 miles to get it home. A bit of a risk for sure, but as long as there are no odd sounds or smells and I know what to expect from the clutch, it seems worth the risk.
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post #10 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 11:40 AM
 
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Post a pic of the print out...Jason

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post #11 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 01:49 PM
 
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This is what I have...
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post #12 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 02:13 PM
 
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That clutch looks pretty well worn honestly....The 70% combined with the clutch wear index over 10K...and The PIS is set pretty low as well.....Sorry...Jason

ASE Master Tech. 29 years experience
Ferrari, Maserati, Land Rover, & Jaguar technician.
Guru in Atlanta of Jaguar V12 & XJS cars.
[email protected] Enzo`s Atlanta is online now  
post #13 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 02:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by [email protected] Enzo`s Atlanta View Post
That clutch looks pretty well worn honestly....The 70% combined with the clutch wear index over 10K...and The PIS is set pretty low as well.....Sorry...Jason
Thanks for the feedback. Can I get ~1000 mostly freeway miles out of it, or should I get it fixed before that distance of a road trip? Iíve got my AAA upgraded just in case
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post #14 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 02:41 PM

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Yeah, with a thickness of 5.56, you're actually sitting at 72% but if that wear index is that high then you're slipping hard. Did the dealer not mention anything about that to you?

Erik Di Somma
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1989 228 (past)
1985 Quattroporte III (past)
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post #15 of 27 Old 06-21-2019, 02:46 PM

InnerCircle
 
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Also, what year is your car? Is it a 2002? I just realized the thread starter was a 06.

Erik Di Somma
2005 Quattroporte
1989 228 (past)
1985 Quattroporte III (past)
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